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Money Can't Buy Happiness, But It Can Book The Wrong Room
The honeymoon from hell takes center stage in our final episode covering White Lotus Season 1. What initially appears to be a simple story of an entitled rich guy and his trophy wife reveals layers of complexity that challenge our first impressions.
When we first meet Shane at the airport with a mysterious body being loaded onto the plane, most viewers jump to the conclusion that he murdered his new bride. This assumption colors everything we see in their relationship. But a second viewing reveals a different story altogether. Shane, while undeniably privileged and sometimes shallow, has legitimate grievances about their accommodations. Hotel manager Armand deliberately antagonizes the situation rather than resolving it professionally, creating a feud that escalates to tragic proportions.
Meanwhile, Rachel struggles with her new identity as Mrs. Patton, claiming to fear losing her journalism career while showing little genuine passion for her work. Her manufactured identity crisis frustrates not just Shane but viewers as well. When Shane's overbearing mother Kitty makes a surprise appearance on their honeymoon, she brutally but accurately calls Rachel out: reconcile with the fact that you married for money and stop pretending otherwise.
What makes this storyline so compelling is how it defies our expectations. No one is simply good or bad—they're complex, flawed people navigating desire and insecurity within systems of wealth and privilege. The fatal confrontation between Shane and Armand serves as the perfect culmination of tensions that have been building throughout the season, reminding us that even paradise can become deadly when egos clash.
Have you experienced a perspective shift when rewatching a show? How did your interpretation of Shane and Rachel's relationship evolve? Subscribe now and join our discussion about how wealth distorts everything—even our ability to see ourselves clearly.
Hi guys, welcome back to next episode With Nick and Jess. And this is our final episode On season one of White Lotus, and I feel like we Saved the best for last, because we're going to be talking about the Honeymooners, shane and Rachel. Yes, alright, so I'm going to Say that. Shane and Rachel. For me, watching the season a second time, I felt different about their story than the first time I watched it. The show starts with Shane in the airport and he's explaining and he's by himself and he's explaining that you know he went on his honeymoon and he saved the white lotus. And they're like oh, somebody, I heard somebody died at the resort. And he's like, yes, their body is being loaded onto the plane. At that moment I decided Shane killed his wife yeah, same, absolutely thought Shane killed his wife.
Speaker 2:I thought that Shane killed his wife.
Speaker 1:Yeah, same Absolutely thought Shane killed his wife. I thought that Shane killed his wife and I watched the entire first season through that lens and waiting for him to kill his wife.
Speaker 1:And so after I watched the season and figured out that he did not kill his wife, when I watched the season a second time I actually felt different about Shane and kind of looked at his situation and his story a little bit different and I kind of softened to him a lot in how I felt about him, compared to when I was convinced that he had killed his wife on their honeymoon.
Speaker 2:No, I made those same assumptions. I have mixed feelings about Shane. I don't think he's annoying, but he's not the worst character. I was waiting for him to kill her, Like, especially when she kind of made it seem like she was going to leave and was unhappy. I was like, oh, this is when it comes. He's about to kill her and he didn't. So then I'm like but did?
Speaker 1:we ever get who the body was who does yes? I'll tell you. We'll discuss it at the end when we get to that point of the discussion.
Speaker 1:So, yes, I'll tell you. I can't believe you don't know who the body is, but I'll tell you when we get there. So when I initially watched the season and I was convinced that Shane kills his wife anytime, he did or said something that I did not like. I was looking for manipulation, control, anger. I was looking for all of those. I was looking for all of those. I was looking for all of those things and it's if you're looking for it. It's very easy to find it because he's not a great person. But if we're being real, none of these guests are good people. None of them so far, have been good people. But I was really painting Shane with a very harsh brush because I was convinced that he was one of those guys, right? So, okay, I'm laughing because this story is the story where Armand, who is the hotel manager, is most prominent, and I will say this Shane is rich, shane is entitled, but the way the manager handled him was completely wrong and he only antagonized the situation. Yes, it was funny.
Speaker 2:It was hilarious. I enjoyed the way Armand antagonized him. I'm not even going to lie, because Shane is an entitled jerk. He really is. He's entitled. He's never had to do anything for himself. He relies on his mommy for everything. It's so clear. I feel like that's part of the reason why Armand handles him the way he handles him. But it is so funny to me Because he was like my mom made the reservation. You want me to call my mom. Would you feel better if you call your mommy Like? I enjoyed that so much so.
Speaker 1:Once again, like these people arrived by boat. These are like the VIP, the top, like like guests that the hotel is entertaining. This is a couple on their honeymoon and Shane's mom booked the honeymoon for them and one of the things that she did was she sent him a virtual room tour to show him the room that was booked room tour to show him the room that was booked. When they get to their room, shane very quickly realizes that this is not the room that he took the tour of yeah, it's a nice room, but it's not the room, it's not the honeymoon suite, it's not the room.
Speaker 1:That was that you know he was supposed to have, right? So? And rachel is like, oh, it doesn't, it doesn't matter, it doesn't matter. And does he dismiss Rachel completely because she grew up poor? He does. He's like you wouldn't know a good room because you've never experienced anything, which is wrong. Yeah, it is wrong, but he is on his honeymoon and they booked and paid for a honeymoon suite yeah. So when he goes to the desk to talk to Armand, Armand completely gaslights him.
Speaker 2:He does.
Speaker 1:Completely gaslights him, completely guessed and at that point, at that point, armand, there was no reason for Armand to treat him like that, because he's the manager, because he's a VIP guest and because the hotel was in the wrong. So I, once again, I'm a hospitality person. I've been a hospitality manager and I've had to have tough conversations when we've made a mistake. I've had to fix situations Like I know what should have happened in that conversation and at that point there was no reason for Armand to treat him like that.
Speaker 2:That's true At that point? Yeah, that's true. He should have just admitted the mistake and tried to rectify it in some way. Exactly and also charge them for the right room, because they did charge them for the room that they didn't get.
Speaker 1:Exactly Like there were so many things that, like Armand did in that moment, that was wrong and messed up. And Shane's reactions, yes, they were a bit much like they he cared too much but at the same time Armand was disrespecting him.
Speaker 1:He was, he was disrespecting him and I'm like, the first time I watched it I was firmly on Armand's side because I felt like Shane was a killer. But when I watched it again I'm like okay, like he's a guest who knows who he is, he's a VIP and he expects to be treated like one and Armand was not treating him like that and Shane deserved to be upset. He did.
Speaker 2:I will give you that yeah.
Speaker 1:Calling your mom is crazy, because I would have called, I would have left and I would have called corporate because paperwork is on my side. He has the booking, he has the room that he stayed Like I would have enjoyed my like stay and I would have called corporate and have them have me stay, come back and stay again in the proper room for free and I do think that's where it gets to be a bit much with Shane is that, like it's bothered him so much that he can't even enjoy his honeymoon.
Speaker 2:and his wife is repeatedly saying that like she wants to enjoy the honeymoon, she doesn't care about the room. There's no way to get him into that room because there's other guests in that room, so you're not going to get the room. And he never lets it go. But Armand is antagonizing him.
Speaker 1:He is. So the kind of things that Armand does gaslighting him, making it seem like that there is not a honeymoon suite, making him seem like that is the, that the room that he's in is the room that he's booked, making it seem like there was not a price difference, you know. Then Shane comes and he tells Armand he wants to do something special for his wife, something romantic. He's like oh, you know, what Can we do? Like a dinner, like a private dinner somewhere on a cliff or on a beach. He was not talking about the room situation. He didn't even at that point, he didn't even ask for a discount or anything. He's just like can you help me set this up? Yeah, or anything. He's just like can you help me set this up? Yeah, armand, being petty, is decides.
Speaker 1:He says. He says, oh, why don't you take a cruise, like a dinner cruise, with your wife, and we'll have? Like, all you have to do is pay for the dinner. Another, like guest, has booked the boat, so you don't have to worry about paying for the boat. As if he's doing him a favor. Armand fully knows at that point that Tanya has booked this boat to throw her mom's ashes out. Tanya has already told him I'm going to be very emotional and this is going to be very hard for me. And Armand still puts that honeymooning couple.
Speaker 2:He puts that honeymooning couple on the boat with Tanya who is grieving the loss which is Tanya's opening, who's grieving the loss of her mother, and in deep mourning knowing that it was going to grow terrible, was excited, was excited when Dylan reported back that it was going terrible.
Speaker 1:He did that on purpose and this is like that and things like that are why I feel like Shane deserves some grace. Now, one thing we did not mention the beginning of the show, armand is the manager and he's and he's sober. He and then like very quickly which to me I don't feel like enough bad things have happened to warrant it he breaks his sobriety and he starts doing drugs and he starts drinking and once that happens, armand is off the chain, off the rails. He does not care about anything anymore, which is why he keeps like this ongoing battle with Shane. I don't think he had broken his sobriety yet when Shane first came to complain. No, he didn't, but he was still rude and mean to him. So it's not even like that.
Speaker 1:Him breaking his sobriety was the reason why he kept it, because he started that back and forth with Shane when he was still sober. But his behavior gets more and more unhinged as he's like doing all of these different drugs, he even like um, what do you call it? Um, the uh. He proposes a like sex tryst with one of his employees, dylan, and he bribes him, propositions him that's what I'm saying. He propositions him and offers him like better, like yeah, if he will sleep with him, and I'm like I really hope Dylan sues the hotel because he slept with him and then he didn't give him anything. Like he was. It was like he was really like really, really wild, but he and Shane are like going at it back and forth and things keep escalating between the two of them. In the midst of that, his wife, rachel, is having some sort of identity crisis and let me tell you something I was so annoyed by her.
Speaker 2:So annoyed, so annoyed, so annoyed Because I was was like, if you don't reconcile with the fact that you married this man for money, like figure it out, you try to act like you have more of a problem than you do this is my thing.
Speaker 1:Okay, when you get married, there is an identity thing that happens. Yeah, like when I had to change my name, I drug my feet for months and months and months. And even before we got married I talked about how I wasn't sure if I would change my name. And my husband was like really upset about that and he's like don't you like what's wrong with my name? Why wouldn't you want my name? And I was trying to explain to him it has nothing to do with him, it has everything to do with me. I've lived my life so long with this name, I've accomplished all of these things with this name, and giving it up feels like giving up me and losing a part of myself. And so I like when she, when he made that comment about Mr and Mrs Patton and she was like oh, that's weird, I understood her in that moment. Every other thing she said I was calling bullshit on.
Speaker 2:Me too. Me too, because I'm like Shane. I do believe Shane loves her. He says some really messed up things to her because he's rich and he knows that she didn't grow up rich. But, like, I do think that he loves her and he loves her. He doesn't have the ability to pretend he is who he's not, he just is who he is.
Speaker 2:But I'm like but you, being a person who, with school, is somewhat more intellectual than him, you know this man is not enough for you. You know what I mean. You like like they don't fit, they don't have a connection, they don't make sense together. Like I get why he is kind of in love and enamored with her. She is not in love and enamored with him and she knows that. So you married him for money I don't care what you say because there's no other. What other quality that he has that drew you to him. But then you're trying to have this little fake identity crisis like, oh my God, am I going to have to give up my career and all this kind of stuff? And I'm like it just feels fake. Reconcile with the fact that you made a decision to marry for money and move on with your life.
Speaker 1:The thing about it is is I wholeheartedly believe that those like comments that he made about her being poor and about her family being poor, that he did not start making those comments on the honeymoon he has. I'm quite sure because, when I agree with you, shane does not hide who he is, he doesn't think there's anything wrong with who he is and he he doesn't have the like emotional mental depth to hide who he is because he doesn't see anything wrong?
Speaker 2:no, he doesn't?
Speaker 1:the person that he is now is the person always been yeah and you said, oh, you married you, you met him, you had gone through a bad breakup and like he was taking you out and showing you all these places that you could never afford to go, and then he wanted to get married. So you did it because you could have easily said, hey, like I'm not ready, let's spend more time together, let's get to know each other, let you. You felt like you, you had a catch. You found a catch. You and because and I'm not trying to be disrespectful her career was not careering, it wasn't, she was not like she is, I don't even know like you she's. Like you're writing click baby articles and you don't even like have a strong passion. Like you're a journalist, but you don't have a point of view. You know how some journalists they do crime or they do politics or they do lifestyle stuff. You know what I mean.
Speaker 2:It's their passion, or investigative journalism. You don't have a passion, you don't have a direction. You're writing puff pieces. I think she doesn't want to write puff pieces, but it's not clear what she does want to write. You don't have any direction in your career and you're taking this out so that you don't have to do anything, but you're having this weird fake identity crisis.
Speaker 1:to me, instead of just like, yeah, I agree, because she.
Speaker 1:There's a way that she wants to be seen right, and then there's a way that she actually wants to be. She wants to be a kept trophy wife, but she doesn't want to be seen as a kept trophy wife, and I can give you an example of that. Okay, she do you remember when she's at the pool and she's talking to the girls and the girls are being really mean with her and icing her out and she gets up and she pulls off her bathing suit and shows off her body and then jumps in the pool as a way to get back at them? You understand where your currency is and where your power lies. You could, you, like those girls were making you feel like you weren't intellectual enough to talk to them, and so to get back at them, you showed them that you were skinnier than them, and so you understand where your power lies. Stop pretending as if you like you want to be the next Barbara Walters, because you don't. You don't, you want to be and that's fine that's fine.
Speaker 2:Resign yourself into the life that you've created and even so.
Speaker 1:Then she's like oh well, you know what? Actually I'm not a good journalist. Maybe I could go work for a non-profit. And the mom who pops up on their honeymoon which was crazy is basically like why would you work at a non-profit when you're not going to get any money and the whole purpose of a nonprofit is to ask rich people for money when you can be on the board and just actually give the money? She was not wrong about that.
Speaker 2:She was not wrong about that. She was not wrong about that. But could I say, another incredible casting, like I was not expecting. Oh, can you look up the actress? Do you know the actress? Molly Shannon. Molly Shannon, I was not expecting.
Speaker 1:Can you?
Speaker 2:look up the actress Molly Shannon. I was not expecting to see Molly Shannon, but I was so excited when I saw Molly Shannon because I was like, oh, that's perfect. That is perfect for the overbearing mother who would encroach on their honeymoon. I was so excited. She was Maybe, that's it. She's kind of reading that girl a little bit like you're trying to act like you are something that you're not. And listen, we're okay with the fact that you're gonna be a trophy wife and you're gonna be rich and enjoy all this money, but you're not gonna pretend like you're an intellectual.
Speaker 1:Molly read her for filth as Kitty she read her for filth.
Speaker 1:She said listen when I got married, I had family money, so I had a little more power. You don't have that, she said. Sometimes you have to find what you have, maybe personality. It's not a career, it's not money, it's not networking, it's not connections, is not networking, is not connections. I suggest you find something that you can do well, instead of sitting here and pretending like like we're doing you wrong, like you joined into this family and you know you didn't have the cachet that we had, so I suggest you find your place and it's in that tiny little body, the ability to have kids.
Speaker 2:And then, yeah, and I do. I do agree if she's dead wrong for coming on this honeymoon and she know it. Um, but like, yeah, no, join a board, become the social like the, the charity face of the family, like you that you help. You know kind of wash, all the trifling stuff they do. But yes, she was not wrong, can I be?
Speaker 1:honest with you. If, like Rachel, really really loved journalism the way that she said that she did, she wouldn't be having an identity crisis because she would start a blog, a lifestyle brand, like she would a blog, a lifestyle brand. She would use her journalism to show the world what this life is that she is walking into. It's a new experience. She could be showing them her journey. She is getting to go undercover in a new world. You're a journalist. You don't see that opportunity because she's not a new world. You're a journalist. You don't see that opportunity because she's not a journalist, she's a whiner.
Speaker 2:No, she's a whiner. And here's the other thing like okay, you could even use the connections that this family has to get you out of writing puff pieces. There's so many things you could do if you wanted to do it. You want to be a trophy wife, so just get over yourself right and like okay.
Speaker 1:So also she kind of kept like making it seem like Shane only loves me for my body and all of this stuff, like I honestly like. Once again, during the second watch Shane actually was like sweet to her in his way, in his way. He is in his, I have to say in his way. But I also have to say that she knew who he was when she married him yeah, so yeah, she knew his flaws, she knew his shortcomings and she still married him.
Speaker 1:But he was nice to her in his way. When she said oh, you know what, I don't, you know, I want more romance, he immediately, immediately went.
Speaker 2:He tried. Armand messed that up, but he really did try.
Speaker 1:He did. He's like listening to her. He told her hey, you know what, you can have whatever kind of career you want to have. He was actually listening to her, he was being supportive of her. He was like you don't have to work, right?
Speaker 2:he was kind of like I don't know why you want to do it, but I'm not going to stop you from doing it exactly, and that's what I'm like.
Speaker 1:I I'm going to be honest and say I did not see it until the second watch, but, honestly, shane is not the villain and she is not the villain and she is not the victim In that situation. No, not at all, shane is just very unselfish With what he wants. He's very up front. He wanted her To be his wife. He loves her, but he's also very sexually attracted and it's also their honeymoon, right, that's literally.
Speaker 2:It's like yeah, it's their honey, it's your honeymoon. So, yeah, like, like, yeah, like that expectation that you're going to like that, that wasn't crazy to me either. He, he is, he's very shallow and superficial. So like, even, like, even him wanting her because of her body, it's like there's not much else to him. You know what I mean, right, like he doesn't have intellectual depth. No, you know. So, like, that's it.
Speaker 1:Right, and so I'm like she's trying to make it seem like all of the that he's doing all of these things and he's creating all of these problems, and he's actually not. He's really not creating all of these problems and he's actually not. He's honestly like the only issue with Shane is that he is going to war with Armand and he won't let it go. But honestly, armand started it and Shane is. He does, and Shane is not the kind of guy to back down. But that's Shane being Shane. I even on his side.
Speaker 2:I would say his other major flaw is that he's over reliant on his mother because he's never had to do anything for himself. Yes, but again you knew that like right with that. Only I want to say and I could be wrong about this one, but I'm pretty sure she said the mom planned the whole wedding too yeah, well, the mom said that, how much work she did planning the wedding wedding she made all the decisions.
Speaker 1:Because if you hear her talk a rachel talk she's like oh, you know what? I was just out of a bad relationship and I met you and you were taking me all of these different places all around town and she was like and then were taking me all of these different places all around town and she was like and then you know, the last five months we've been doing the wedding stuff, I'm like, but the mom was really doing the majority of the wedding stuff. That's not why you weren't working, sweetie. You did not want to work, and that's okay.
Speaker 2:But don't try to blame him and not take accountability for your decisions right, but you not taking your career seriously Because, like, yeah, like it is okay to not want to work because you've created a situation where you don't have to work, so that's fine, but nobody is taking your career from you, like and I've seen rich men that do stuff like that, like that do kind of limit the way.
Speaker 1:That is not what Shane is doing, he's not he's's, not because the fact that she thought even to say it to him, spent time considering writing an article on her honeymoon. It was disgusting and it was completely disrespectful and crazy because Shane wasn't taking work calls.
Speaker 2:No, he wasn't taking work calls. No, he wasn't sending work emails. I said he didn't have a job.
Speaker 1:No, he works for his family's real estate company. It's a family business, but yeah, he works for his family real estate business, so he does have a job, but he honestly he wasn't taking phone calls, he wasn't taking email, everything.
Speaker 2:Any correspondence was about that damn room. If you act like you, not writing this puff piece is going to end your journalism career when anybody would understand that you are on your honeymoon. Honestly, women get more pushback for taking leave for having a baby than being on their honeymoon. Nobody was going to never offer you another article again because you said no on your honeymoon. You make going to never get offer you another article again because you, you said no on your honeymoon. You, you, you make enough stuff.
Speaker 1:The thing about it is is because she has that financial support, she can write about whatever she wants she doesn't have to. Honestly, she doesn't have to take jobs. You can write something and then try to sell it you can freelance.
Speaker 2:You can write two or three articles a year and just make sure that they are really excellent, because you have that financial backing.
Speaker 1:You can do academic stuff. He was not holding her back when I tell you she manufactured and created that identity crisis for no reason, no reason.
Speaker 2:So when Belinda does shut her down from fixing her, it was so satisfying At some point she goes to Belinda crying and trying to help and Belinda's like I ain't got it today.
Speaker 1:No, because Belinda's been through enough. She's already been used up. No, because millennium been through enough. She's already been used up. Like her, she's already had a guest like steal all of her emotional healing from her. So, like, the feud between Armand and Shane keeps escalating. Like Shane is asking for his boss's like number and Armand is giving him the runaround. And like Shane has, like his travel agent, call and like, tell Armand off, like, and it gets to the point where eventually, the the uh, armand's manager does get involved and Armand thinks that he's already in like in this unhinged, drug-fueled like rage, right, and at this point rachel is like she's left the room.
Speaker 1:I think she's got in her defecate in shane's suitcase. Now, one to one caveat, the robbery that we talked about in the previous episode with the moss barkers has already happened and shane is aware that there was a robbery and shane and is now in the honeymoon suite, which is the nicest suite in the hotel. So he's worried because he's like, how did this person get into the room? You know, are we going to get robbed? You know next? So Shane is already on edge because, like, he found out about another guest being robbed and Armand sneaks into his room to defecate in his suitcase and Shane finds it.
Speaker 1:Shane finds it. He's understandably upset. I can't even imagine, girl, I can't even. I can't even process how I would have acted. It would have been worse than Shane. I feel like Shane was livid, he was process how I would have acted. It would have been worse than Shane. Yeah, like I feel like Shane Was livid, he was angry, but I would honestly lose my mind and the hotel is like oh, do you think your wife Did it? That's what would have took in me, that's what would have pushed me over the edge. So Shane does not realize that Armand is still in the room. And so, like Shane eventually realizes that Armand is still in the room and I don't think he knows that it's Armand- no I can't when they're fighting.
Speaker 1:He thinks that he's being robbed and that person who robbed him wrapped in his suitcase and like they end up fighting and Shane stabs Armand.
Speaker 2:Armand is the dead body oh, because they said it was a woman at the beginning they never said it was a woman.
Speaker 1:They never said it was a woman. No, no, we assumed he killed his wife because his wife wasn't there and they just said a dead body. We assumed he killed his wife because his wife wasn't there and they just said a dead body. We assumed it was he killed his wife.
Speaker 2:But yeah, it was Armand okay, okay, yeah, I don't know how I missed that either, um, because I remember I saw the fight. I remember him stabbing him. I guess did I just not assume that Armand was dead? Mm-hmm, okay, maybe that was it okay.
Speaker 1:So it's Armand, oh yeah, and that's really sad because, honestly, even though he's a terrible, hotel manager.
Speaker 2:So entertaining when I tell you I know all the stuff that he's doing is wrong, but it is so entertaining, it is so, so, like I'm smiling, like all the scenes with him and Shane are hilarious to me. Shane is an entitled jerk and so he's never had to really deal with anything in his life. I think that's also why it's so funny. This is the most difficult situation Shane has ever had in his life. He's dealing with a difficult hotel manager.
Speaker 1:Right. So if you look at how things escalate, tanya steals Belinda's time and her energy. The Mossbockers steal Kai's freedom Although it's really Paula that does it, I lump her in with them they still Kai's freedom. And Shane steals Armand's life. He stole Armand's life, isn't that wild, mm-hmm. But I Shane is not a villain though.
Speaker 2:He's not a villain. It's hard with that one because you still got somebody in your room. You know what I mean and that's the scariest thing ever. You go to a hotel, like you know. I went to a hotel one time and someone it was in a joining room, but of course I didn't know the person on the other side of the joining room and they just kept jiggling the handle and that scared the crap out of me. So I can't even imagine coming into your room and there's someone else in there.
Speaker 1:It was self-defense it was self-defense. The thing about it is that the situation didn't have to get to that point. It didn't. And if one of them would have been willing to step down. But Armand is in, like this drug binge, and so he doesn't have the capacity to step down, and Shane has never, like you said, been inconvenienced before, so of course he doesn't have the capacity to step down. On top of that, his relationship with his wife is falling apart and he can't figure out why.
Speaker 1:He doesn't understand, and I feel that because he really can't figure it out, because she is just tripping.
Speaker 2:Because it doesn't make sense. She's just manufacturing an issue and I agree that that whole name thing is a thing that you have to wrestle with as a woman who gets married, changing your name and how attached you are to your identity. That's the realest part about her whole little identity crisis.
Speaker 1:That's the only real part, because my question is why do you have all of these questions now? Why didn't you interrogate these feelings before you got married? Before you got married?
Speaker 2:You had five months of wedding planning to interrogate these feelings, where you were perfectly happy.
Speaker 1:Why didn't you ask why didn't you ask yourself these questions what will my life look like after I'm married? Am I going to keep doing journalism? But, like there's no reason, like even the even if she had all of those questions, none of those questions needed to be answered on the honeymoon. No, she shouldn't have even been able to have access to find out that they wanted to give her that job, because she shouldn't have been checking her email or answering work calls. You were on your honeymoon. It was like almost as soon as she got to the hotel, she started tripping. She started tripping. She started tripping. She started tripping from the time they called her Mrs Patton.
Speaker 2:Yeah, she did, she did, you know, and I'm like and here's the thing, you could have checked, shane, about him basically calling you poor all the time. You know what I mean, because I do think that there's a part of him that cares and he's never lived outside of his own world. You know what I mean. So I'm like, but I do think he cares enough about her to at least try, you know right, so I don't know how far she would have got with it, but I think he cares enough, like his care in his own way again, is genuine. And I'm like you don't really like this guy, but you like what he attaches to him, which, again, I'm not even judging you for at this point in life. I'm not even judging you for I just need you to get over yourself.
Speaker 1:I was asking myself during the second rewatch, when I because I, during the first rewatch I was just holding on waiting for Shane to kill her, but during the second rewatch I was just holding on waiting for Shane to kill her. But during the second rewatch I was like, why does she like him? She doesn't seem to like anything about him. She doesn't like how attracted he is to her. She doesn't seem to enjoy his personality. Exactly, they don't seem to have things in common. She does not like his family. What does she like about him? And you know, we've seen these shows before, right, where we don't understand why a couple is together, right, but we then learn why they're together, like through the show. The show will show us different things, why they're together. Like through the show, the show will show us different things. And, honestly, we never got that from this show because she does not like him.
Speaker 2:She doesn't like him, and that's the thing and I'm like. So either reconcile with yourself that like I don't like him but I want to marry him because I want to be attached to this money, you know, find things that you can like about him. There are he has likable characteristics, he does. I think you could find something Heck, even if it's just his body.
Speaker 1:Right, he's not unattractive. You know what I mean. He seems to be fun-loving and, honestly, he seems open to her having a life that she can be happy with.
Speaker 2:He does, I think he genuinely wants her to be happy with he does. I think he listens to her. I think he genuinely wants her to be happy. He doesn't know what's gonna make her happy. Of course she doesn't know what's gonna make her happy, but I think he's open to like you know, but whatever she decides is gonna make her happy, I think he'd be, he'd be cool with it. He seems like it right?
Speaker 1:I agree, he's not. He's not as terrible of a person as I thought and she although I knew she was annoying when I watched it the first time like oh, she's getting on my nerves. When I watched it the second time, I said she is a problem and honestly, she's part of the reason why armand gets killed, because he's having so many problems with her and he's fixating on the thing that he feels like he can fix, which is the room situation, thinking maybe if I can get her into this room and it'd be nice, maybe she'll calm down. You know what I'm saying? Like so she was part of the reason why he was so fixated on this room, because he's trying to get like them, to chill out and have fun.
Speaker 2:And she'll say, oh, don't worry about the room, let's just have a good time, but then she's not a good time she's not she's so dry and I guess it may be like in some way I see that connection with her and the girls, because it's like you think you're deeper than you are, like you really are shallow as well.
Speaker 1:Absolutely, absolutely shallow, completely shallow, because, like, all of her problems are manufactured and you're making it seem like he's a stumbling block to what you want to do and he's actually not. You admit that like you are, like your life was not going well, you were like in a desperate place and now he's telling you hey, you know you can do it.
Speaker 2:You cannot do it, but like it's our honeymoon, like let's just, let's enjoy the honeymoon and you make it seem like he's trying to hold you hostage and turn you into a separate wife, and that man is not trying to do that and I would say this is the one good point he and his mom have about the money is that the money makes it so you can really do whatever you want to do. Figure out what the heck you want to do. That's just facts. That's not even them being arrogant rich assholes, that's just facts. The money that you don't have to worry about money means you can really take your time and figure out whatever the heck it is you want to do.
Speaker 1:Right.
Speaker 1:But like let's not marry into a rich family, but they want to like, like, for them to pretend, like that's not what it is. You knew that you were marrying way, way up when you did it and Shane is not an egalitarian person. So he he's, he was never like oh I'm wealthy but that doesn't make a difference. No, he leads with his wealth, like he does, like. That is very important to his identity and you knew all of those things when you met him. He's not the villain. No, not really. She made me side with a man, okay, she made me side with a rich man right, crazy, work, crazy.
Speaker 1:And like. My question is like how are we supposed to feel about Armand? Like knowing that he ends up dying, but also I didn't want him to die he was such a good entertaining character, like as long as he was.
Speaker 2:I think that you know, the funny thing is like the stuff with Shade doesn't even really bother me because it's so entertaining the stuff that he did to Dylan that was like right, and also him being inappropriate with the guest.
Speaker 1:Stuff that he did to Dylan. That was like uh, literally Right. And also him being inappropriate with the guests. Who, yes, was inappropriate with him first. Oh no, I don't have no problem with that he would not let it go, though he kept going after him.
Speaker 2:I have no problem. Like what he, what the, what the dad said to him was so egregious.
Speaker 2:I ain't got no problems with how he treated him, even though, like, he was supposed to be the manager of the hotel and he was doing everything but managing the hotel and that's the thing, like I honestly, truly would have felt better about him having an inappropriate relationship with the dad than him having an inappropriate relationship with dylan, because dylan is in a vulnerable position, like the dad you proposition in this dad who just says something crazy to you. I don't have no feelings about that. Y'all both grown, y'all are comparable ages. There's I mean, I guess there's a, you could say there's a power imbalance, but it doesn't feel like it really.
Speaker 1:Well, the power imbalance would not be in Armand's favor, though, if there is a power imbalance, but it would be in the favor of Mark, because Mark's the guest.
Speaker 2:Right, Right. But I'm saying, but even so, even then it doesn't feel like Mark is using, I guess, you know just, I guess just to be invasive, but not like you have to sleep, you know what. I mean Right, but that's what he did to Dylan basically, but that's what he did to Dylan and that's why that, to me, is the worst thing that Armand did.
Speaker 1:So yeah, I don't understand, like, because, like in the first episode, like Armand is like talking to the trainee and he's like telling her all of these things, oh, everything must be perfect, we must serve them, and all of this stuff and then he immediately starts doing the opposite. Mm, hmm, and immediately.
Speaker 2:The fact that that was. We never saw that that girl again, and you pointed that out to me, I'm like we never did see her. She left to go have the baby. We never saw her again, or her tail, other than the.
Speaker 1:I don't understand why they put that in the show at all. There was no like. That served no purpose whatsoever and I kept waiting for it to tie back in, but it was like the most random thing in the world in the world. I don't understand. It's like I honestly feel like they're like oh we, we need to have more Hawaiian cast members. Okay, let's just create a maid and give her like a oh, she wasn't a maid, she was like a resort worker, essentially and let's give her a couple of speaking lines in the first episode.
Speaker 2:See, I'm like did they have something that tied her in that they cut, Because that's what it felt like to me.
Speaker 1:I don't know, I don't know, I don't know, but I'm like there was no real purpose for her teeny tiny storyline in there at all. Yeah, because it didn't help develop the characters at all. You know what I'm saying. It was very weird. I don't know, it was very weird, it was very out of place. But I will say, overall, I did enjoy the first season. It was like for me to enjoy a show and they also have so many unlikable people. It's a testament, it's a skill.
Speaker 2:Well, I would say, okay, I'm mixed, Like I did not enjoy. I didn't fully enjoy watching. There were moments that, well, I'm mixed, I didn't fully enjoy watching it. There were moments that I enjoyed, but I felt like I was waiting for something to happen that never happened in the show.
Speaker 1:What would that thing have?
Speaker 2:been. I don't know. I thought there was something underlying going on at the resort. There was some kind of secret. I thought there was something that was going to happen. That never happened, but I did enjoy talking about it. I enjoyed talking about these characters.
Speaker 1:Now realizing that Armand died, do you feel any different? Because that was the thing that they foreshadowed in the first episode. It was going to be. The thing that was going to happen Is that what it is that I missed, that Armand died.
Speaker 2:I don't know why, probably because I like the villains. A lot of times I do enjoy the villains. They're just more interesting characters. So maybe that's like I just wasn't. I wasn't, my brain was not accepting that Armand is gone.
Speaker 1:Well, you were like who died? I'm like what do you mean? Who died?
Speaker 2:I saw that whole scene. I watched it. Actually, like you know, I was paying attention. I saw him get stabbed and it still did not click that he died and but it also in my mind. Yeah, I was assuming so hard that it was a woman and that it was his wife and so I thought they said a woman. I thought he said a woman died on our trip. I completely missed that yeah.
Speaker 1:So I'm going to tell you there's something that happened in the show that I completely missed and I saw somebody reference it on TikTok and then I went back and I'm like, how did I not see that? So if you go to the first episode and you go in about 20 minutes, I want you to do it when we're done and I want you to, like, go in and in about 20 minutes into the first episode and just pay attention and tell me if you saw that. No, I'm not going to tell you. Tell me if you saw that scene the first time you watched the show, because I did not. I was like was this, was this scene in the show the first time? Because I don't remember it at all and so you know, sometimes we miss things and so things are pointed out to us. So don't feel bad, but yeah, I enjoyed talking about the show yeah, and you were talking about it and so we keep throughout this season running into what is a story.
Speaker 1:So maybe for you this story was not entertaining, but it was intellectually stimulating because it created good conversation.
Speaker 2:Yeah, because it just kept building to something. It was building suspense and I feel like I never got that payoff. But I guess if Orman's death was the thing it was building to, okay, I don't know, maybe on a rewatch I'll feel differently when you think about it.
Speaker 1:That's kind of shocking because he went. Everything changed so rapidly. The show starts he's the long-term manager of a high-end resort and within the span of what? Eight episodes? He is on a drug-fueled binge feud with the guest. That ends in his death.
Speaker 2:Yeah, that is Okay, okay, Okay, I'll give you that I don't know. And here's the thing I do get attached to characters Like so much. So, like you know, I told you I'm watching Game of Thrones right now For the first time. This is the first time for me Because I'm, you know, I'm a little bit scary, and blood, guts and stuff like that scare me. So, anyway, when it gets to the scene, the first Sam Turley, I believe, is his last name, but Sam from the Wall, the chubby guy who is a ghillie I think it's Tarwell, something like that but his first name is Sam.
Speaker 2:When Sam gets to the scene where he's hiding Ghillie in that little house, and then he comes out and the White Walkers there, I stopped. It's like 10 minutes from the ending of that episode. I stopped and I did not turn it back on for days because I was like I am not prepared to lose Sam. Sam is great, though I love Sam. So I'm like I don't know if my brain, like I know Armand is a terrible person, but I just find him so entertaining, so I'm like I just literally did not see that he died.
Speaker 1:I just my brain is like no, he went to a farm to live out his life running around with other Armands it's so stupid. But no, like Game of Thrones is a show where you cannot get attached to a character because they have no qualms killing them. The first time I watched the show, which was when it first came out many, many, many moons ago, when they killed Ned Stark, I was like what. It blew my mind. I'm like wait a minute. He was the main character of the show.
Speaker 1:He's gone. How are we going to have a show? You just realized that. Listen, he is one of many people that we will meet.
Speaker 2:Yeah that when I saw that part I think it's towards the end of season two, the red wedding, season two, episode nine I'm like I'm still shocked when they kill the wife and the son and I was like there are no more Starks. We ain't got nothing but baby Starks.
Speaker 1:Right, they decimated an entire family.
Speaker 2:We're out of Starks now. Did y'all mean to do this? Did you know that we ran out of Starks?
Speaker 1:we can't go get a MacArthur did you know that the Starks were a short supply? Yeah, and it's. You're not used to that like major power players. And then it's like hold on, they were essentially almost like the king and queen of. And then it's like hold on, like they were essentially like almost like the King and queen of their area. That's how respected they were. And they like, dang, they just killing them up. That's wild, like who does that? Well, george RR Martin does.
Speaker 2:Right. So like the same way I'm like, cause I'm like. You know, I think I had a big idea that everybody wasn't coming back for the second season, but I would have thought it would have been Armand, belinda and Tanya.
Speaker 1:Now, what made you feel like she would come back for the second season?
Speaker 2:Because she's already talking about going to another resort.
Speaker 1:Oh, okay, okay, okay, but yeah. So let me know when you're ready to start watching season two, and I'll do it again. But I'm just gonna warn you like you're gonna be like who are these folks and why are we in?
Speaker 2:Italy, right. Well, yeah, I think that's gonna be the biggest shock it feels weird, like why are we in Italy?
Speaker 1:like like so, yeah, so let me know, I really enjoy talking with you about the white lotus I. I feel like I got like even actually I feel like I got a deeper appreciation for the show talking to you about it and giving like, giving my. Uh, I feel like controversial. I feel like to me, my takes on the show are very controversial because no one's going to be like let's leave our kid in Hawaii, or Shane is not actually that bad of a guy.
Speaker 2:Armand is the problem. As funny as he is, Armand is the problem.
Speaker 1:And Tanya doesn't deserve a happy ending. Tanya, she doesn't, she's a succubus.
Speaker 2:She's a succubus a bit, but yeah, she's going to go from one man to another using her for her money. But I think she's okay with that because she likes to use her money as power.
Speaker 1:So we'll see you guys next time. I think next we have something really fun, more lighthearted, coming up. I think you guys will really enjoy it. Have a great day, bye.